Comments on The Science of Sport: Caster Semenya - cover-ups, lies and confusion

July 31, not August.

2010-09-29T01:35:20.372+02:00

July 31, not August.

Interesting read, thanks

2010-09-29T01:35:19.380+02:00

Interesting read, thanks

Hi anonymous Thanks for the comments. I guess I&...

2009-10-02T10:13:37.275+02:00

Hi anonymous

Thanks for the comments. I guess I've kind of left the story for a while - to me, the story ended when ASA were revealed to have lied, and until more information is revealed (maybe by the IAAF in November), I'm rather 'over' the whole matter. But you're right, a timeline would be interesting. However, I don't think I can justify a whole post, because to most people, this issue has been drawn out too much!

But just for your info:

The conference where Pierre Weiss spoke on Semenya's behalf was immediately after her race in Berlin, on 19 August.

The team then arrived back in SA on the Tuesday after that, the 25th (or maybe the 24th, I can't quite recall). That's when the political circus began - at the airport.

There was a spate of media interviews in the the next two weeks, mostly involving Leonard Chuene, Wilf Daniels, and I did the occasional one.

Wilfred Daniels resigned on the first Sunday in September, giving fuel to the media's quest for answers from within ASA.

At that point, the IAAF issued a statement saying that they would no longer comment. I can't recall exactly when that was, but I'd guess the end of August, in that week.

Then, on 12th and 13th September, ASA had a meeting where they gave Chuene a vote of confidence. The media reports continued (just about every day).

The media then discovered the emails, and that is pretty much where the post above came from.

As for Semenya, she hasn't spoken, with the exception of that conference at the airport, and then a function when she returned home to her village. And that's all. I see there is an interview with her in the latest Runners World, but that's all. ASA have kept her from the media through this.

Regards
Ross

Hi I've been following your commentary - than...

2009-10-02T03:24:32.299+02:00

Hi
I've been following your commentary - thanks so much for your thoroughness, insight, and clarity about the politics and science behind Caster Semenya's unfortunate and instructive situation... The timeline you provide is especially helpful. I was wondering if you would be able/willing to extend it to clarify what happened after where you left off. I've been trying to reconstruct the story myself from different sources but I'm not sure of the chronology. I'm specifically interested about the different media and public events that have happened throughout. When was Semenya awarded the medal in relation to everything? When was the press conference where IAAF rep Pierre Weiss spoke on behalf of Semenya and other major interviews with her? When was the airport rally in Johannesburg? Etc.
Just fyi, I'm a writer really interested in gender issues and public life and the place of individuality in all that. Caster Semenya is inadvertently the pressure point of so much; I think of her experience and disposition in relation to the unfolding case.
A complete timeline would be amazing and would make this site as authoritative as possible on the case! Thought you might have the knowledge and be interested in posting that.
Thanks very much

Hi All, I have read that piece in allafrica too a...

2009-09-29T18:33:42.661+02:00

Hi All,
I have read that piece in allafrica too and I think a lot of the stuff said there make sence. After all people did not consul sociologists and religious experts in all of this. Is she to compete with men then? No? who then should she compete with? She was raised a woman, its not like she did a sex change or anything like that. She is a creation of God and she deserves all the rights that are granted all human beings in this world, including the right to exploit your potential.No wonder the poor girl cried when sh e was told she could't run. After all she is a child of God too just like yu and I and she is not an animal. we need to be more enlightened and spiritual and compasionate.

Hi Anonymous Wow, that's incredible. Of all ...

2009-09-28T15:22:09.331+02:00

Hi Anonymous

Wow, that's incredible. Of all the pieces I've read on this issue, that has got to be the worst one...

Thanks for the link, what an incredible piece. The mind spins at things like this...

Ross

I'm going to post a link to an article on the ...

2009-09-28T14:49:53.696+02:00

I'm going to post a link to an article on the Semenya scandal I just read, it is so stupid, and absurd, and just plain ignorant that it's difficult even now, 10 min later to stop giggling. So by all means, read it, and laugh....and laugh..and probably cry a little too.

http://allafrica.com/stories/200909280913.html

Hi Jason You're 100% right. I agree. The cr...

2009-09-28T12:34:08.494+02:00

Hi Jason

You're 100% right. I agree. The cramp issue is something we've covered a lot in the past - maybe it's time to revisit it.

But go here: http://www.sportsscientists.com/2008/01/featured-series-on-science-of-sport.html

And then scroll down the list and you've find a series of articles on cramp.

But you're 100% right, the cramp issue is caused by fatigue, which is why Andrew Strauss was 100% right to deny Smith a runner - maybe Strauss knew something we did not. You can't have a runner when you are too tired to avoid a cramp.

As for the players being unfit, that's a rumor that has certainly been going around, and yes, 5 or 6 of the players look in need of some training. Cricket seems to allow players who are far from highly trained to succeed. History is littered with batsmen and bowlers who are, frankly, not great athletes.

I may do a short post on this in the future.

Cheers
Ross

I've found your posts very helpful and intelli...

2009-09-28T01:17:19.444+02:00

I've found your posts very helpful and intelligent.

Thanks.

Hi Ross, Jonathan, I'm afraid I missed the 3r...

2009-09-27T23:10:02.790+02:00

Hi Ross, Jonathan,

I'm afraid I missed the 3rd degree episode you mentioned because I was watching South Africa once again self-implode in an important cricket game. I'm particularly irritated because our chances of winning this evening evaporated as Graeme Smith began suffering cramp and was hampered throughout the latter half of his innings. The England captain denied him a runner, as is his prerogative, and the innings petered to a slow disappointing finish.

The thing thats killing me is this is not the first time that this has happened to the South African Cricket team during Smith's tenure. I can remember at least 3 other occasions when South Africa have lost games that they might have won as a result of cramp, once in a world cup and once in a previous champions trophy game.

My question is, when are we going to start learning from our mistakes? I haven't seen a batsman from any other country in the world succumb to cramp, ever. From my limited knowledge of the cramp phenomenon, I understand that cramp is related to fatigue. People don't just cramp at the onset of exercise, they need to cause fatigue in the muscle first. Cramp is often blamed on dehydration, and loss of electrolytes, and this may be part of the problem - but doesn't explain why cramps are localized while dehydration/electrolyte loss should affect the whole body.

The SA cricket team is clearly stuck in the model of treating cramp with increased fluid intake, as drinks were regularly run out to Smith, but this clearly didn't do the job.

My theory is that if cramp is related to fatigue, there are 2 possible solutions to the cramp problem which go hand in hand - 1. lose weight, as carrying less weight would mean that the muscle take longer to fatigue; 2. improve the level of physical conditioning as a player with more muscular endurance should be able to avoid cramp for longer.

It is no secret that despite their recent successes the SA cricket team does not look like a group of international standard athletes. There are a few who are frankly "chubby". I realise that members of the national team and management will probably point to their recent successes as a justification of their fitness regime, but surely a team who is ranked best in the world should be trying all possible means to cement their position. South Africa have failed once again to throw off their tags as chokers in major competitions, surely this is one problem that could be easily overcome with a little expert advise?

Possibly you could do a post on the complexities of cramp to shed some light on the issue?

Ya is there any progress guys? Anyone?

2009-09-27T19:24:00.827+02:00

Ya is there any progress guys? Anyone?

So How did the meeting of people to discuss Chuene...

2009-09-27T19:22:33.115+02:00

So How did the meeting of people to discuss Chuene 's fate go. Not very goog HA? Is that why you have indigestion ross?

Yes, it's a wonderful piece in the Herald (gov...

2009-09-25T21:57:25.160+02:00

Yes, it's a wonderful piece in the Herald (government mouthpiece in Harare). I've pulled this quote from Conway Tutani's article:

Chuene finally acknowledged that the lying game was up when he came clean on Saturday after being discovered, but he was still not contrite enough by insisting that he had lied in good faith, with good intentions, and would not resign. How can all this sit together and make sense?

There is the herd instinct side. Naturally or instinctively, people within a group close ranks like cattle or buffaloes when they perceive a threat or feel that they are under attack, but let’s not let this become an obsession. By obsessing with or seeing racism where it is not there, we end up being paranoid. This paranoia is symptomatic of an inferiority complex. At the end of the day, we are giving too much respect and credit to racists by displaying an underlying inferiority complex.

Hi Zoe great post, great link. THank you! I hav...

2009-09-25T18:56:33.874+02:00

Hi Zoe

great post, great link. THank you!

I have been thinking about what to post all day, kind of digesting the latest news, planning what to write.

In the end, all I got was indigestion and so wrote nothing. Maybe tomorrow will be better, but this is a great link. One thing I had thought is that there are few countries where public officials can do what they do in SA and get away with it. Zimbabwe was one that I thought of, but now it seems I'm wrong!

Ross

Even in Zimbabwe they think this is pretty rank.

Touche!!!!

2009-09-25T12:41:09.650+02:00

Touche!!!!

I'm lost for words. It's amazing. Althou...

2009-09-25T09:18:00.356+02:00

I'm lost for words. It's amazing.

Although, I'll say this much, I half expected it, given how the federation is run, and its history. Remember, these same people said he handled the matter "exceptionally well" less than 2 weeks ago. So it was on the cards.

Doesn't make it any more believable, in any other country, the outcomes would be so different. I'm trying to think about how to approach the latest news in a post, which I should do later today, I hope.

But ASA now deserve everything that comes their way, and I hope it's what they get. It's disgraceful.

Chuene retains presidency... That's pretty mes...

2009-09-24T15:56:09.344+02:00

Chuene retains presidency... That's pretty messed up folks.

http://www.iol.co.za/index.php?set_id=6&click_id=4&art_id=nw20090924150251393C449095

This whole issue is getting very, very political. ...

2009-09-24T10:09:15.303+02:00

This whole issue is getting very, very political. And I imagine it is only the beginning. Just saw this:

http://www.mg.co.za/article/2009-09-24-sex-lies-and-funny-money

It has also emerged that controversial ASA president Leonard Chuene has allegedly been drawing a salary of R35 000 a month. Board members and the president are elected to their positions and should therefore not earn a salary.

ASA responded to the allegations. “ASA is not in a financial crisis. ASA is a non-profit organisation and any surplus funds arising shall be used for the benefit of athletics in South Africa. Chuene is not earning a salary. He is receiving an allowance in line with the general corporate governance principles. This is a normal practice in companies and other sport formations.”

Nedbank, once one of ASA’s biggest sponsors, has withdrawn from its R17-million-a-year deal with the association for the 2010 season. The sponsorship covered the Nedbank City Marathon and Matha Series in Free State, Gauteng, Limpopo, Eastern Cape, Western Cape and Mpumalanga.

Hi anonymous Thanks for the reply. I'll go o...

2009-09-23T20:44:37.856+02:00

Hi anonymous

Thanks for the reply. I'll go on Facebook and see if I can reply to that one.

I'm also hoping to get some time tomorrow to summarize the latest revelations from the 3rd Degree report. I must say, the key bits where the initial email from the IAAF, and the fact that Chuene did in fact first decide to pull her out, and then backtracked and took political advice to let her run.

I think what I will probably do is wait for the ASA council meeting before posting anything further. I'm also trying to get hold of transcripts of the show so that I can post accurately what was said int he press conference.

Hopefully tomorrow...

Thanks!
Ross

Anon here again, here is also the link to the Cast...

2009-09-23T20:25:03.210+02:00

Anon here again, here is also the link to the Caster Semenya Facebook page titled "In Support of Caster Semenya and African Women", I would LOVE for you to go in there and clear things up there too, since they have made a whole thread about it!

http://www.facebook.com/topic.php?uid=138817440971&topic=10861

Thanx for setting the record straight on that one,...

2009-09-23T20:16:11.974+02:00

Thanx for setting the record straight on that one, Ross. I started to get a bit worried after reading this rumor on facebook pages that cater to Semenya fans, as well as that forum in question, here is the link:

http://www.forumosa.com/taiwan/viewtopic.php?f=63&t=82191

Can't wait for your report on the "3rd degree" program.

Hi again Anonymous Do you happen to have the URL ...

2009-09-23T20:07:02.347+02:00

Hi again Anonymous

Do you happen to have the URL of that forum? I'm quite keen to just set the rumor straight...

Thanks
Ross

Hi Anonymous Wow, one has to be careful here. Tr...

2009-09-23T19:58:47.854+02:00

Hi Anonymous

Wow, one has to be careful here. Trust me, I saw the name Jelimo in that email as well - it made me do a double take and as a result I went back on the show (which I recorded) and read the email over and over.

So let me clarify exactly what it said:

First, it was NOT sent by Pierre Weiss, it was sent byt he IAAF PR guy, and was an internal email to a group of recipients that included Weiss.

This email was sent at a time when the IAAF were beginning to investigate whether reports of Semenya might warrant further investigation. They came across a website that alledged that Semenya had been tested in SA.

The email was sent with the header "Just to be aware of. We may get some more Jelimo type questions about this one".

That is not proof that she is intersex. Of course, people will read it how they wish to, but I find it very difficult to believe that this heading means she IS intersex.

All it means is that she was questioned. But then most people already suspected that, so to me, nothing new out of this, apart from the confirmation that yes, the IAAF were asked questions about Jelimo.

I think one has to be careful here, because that forum has basically made three or four key mistakes.

It has the sender incorrect, the recipient incorrect, the header incorrect, and the implication incorrect.

Talk about broken telephone...

Ross

I found this post on a forum online today, after I...

2009-09-23T19:09:16.411+02:00

I found this post on a forum online today, after I heard that the 3rd degree episode last night outed Pamela Jelima as intersexed as well. It looks like one of the posters here who questioned Jelimo a week ago or so, could be right in his suspicion.

"An email from Pierre Weiss to the IAAF president published on 3rd degree(a South African programme The subject line read" JUST TO BE AWARE OF, WE MAY HAVE MORE JELIMO'S?"